Tuesday Links
Gowanus Houses. Photo by limonada. Home Insurers Canceling Policies in the East [NY Times] As Loan Defaults Rise, Washington Worries [NY Times] Meet Local 79’s Nonunion Rat Wrangler [NY Times] FDNY May Set Up Pension Housing Fund [NY Daily News] Newcomers Cookin’ in Latest Zagat [NY Daily News] Atlantic Yards Still Needs Watchdog [NY Daily…
Gowanus Houses. Photo by limonada.
Home Insurers Canceling Policies in the East [NY Times]
As Loan Defaults Rise, Washington Worries [NY Times]
Meet Local 79’s Nonunion Rat Wrangler [NY Times]
FDNY May Set Up Pension Housing Fund [NY Daily News]
Newcomers Cookin’ in Latest Zagat [NY Daily News]
Atlantic Yards Still Needs Watchdog [NY Daily News]
Council Members Rake in Extra Income [NY Sun]
Ratner Closing AY-Area Streets Soon [NY Sun]
Bloomberg’s Barrage of Numbers [Gotham Gazette]
Oddly Named Condos [Brooklyn Eagle]
Our Mayor is a Square [Lost City]
g-man,
I never really suggested closing Atlantic Avenue. I was rhetorically musing on it since this is essentially where the tracks run (i.e. they don’t run under the Carlton Ave. bridge). Of course, they won’t close Atlantic, thank goodness. But…that said, there may be repeated, if not constant lane closures causing congestion on Atlantic.
Now, let’s not eat up and believe a blurb in the Sun, of all rags. Just because they reproduced a press release and are reiterating a future possibility, not a fact, it seems unlikely to many that any real work will begin as soon as you suggest.
Regarding backroom deals: There were plenty of course, but I don’t think FCR is doing any work like this from a backroom agreement. Let’s go back to the documents and have a look. I can’t imagine FCR would agree to move rail tracks just for the luxury of maybe getting the whole project going. Doesn’t make sense…too expensive (or, like in most things, it’s probably our taxes and fares that will pay for this work…).
Still, regarding some need to close the Carlton Ave. bridge: Why? Setting up new tracks is not like constructing the CERNE particle accelerator. The bridge does not have to come down because two sets of rails are laid. This isn’t the first time in history rails have been laid. They can be laid in tight tunnels, under existing bridges, and heck, even under the English Channel in tubes. There is plenty of headroom if the bridge is kept in place.
Basically, all things considered, I smell a rat. And, I still think the press release that led to the blurb in the Sun and a real eventual closing of the streets and Carlton Ave. bridge are all a PR move.
When and if the bridge closes, the things I have repeatedly mentioned as my concerns will hit full face. There are no notices out on the street, nothing in the community informing people what will happen. A bridge closing will disrupt lives and the vast majority of drivers, pedestrians and cyclists will probably only know the thing is closed off when they come across a road block one day.
The people who are impacted will probably be disregarded and this will foment more ill will.
1:58/5:40, I’m down with a semi-private sidebar conversation (with the occasional hyphenated-all-caps declaration). First off, no, I didn’t (really) address the “main concerns” that you summarize at the end of your second post. I’m not defending this project, hence my closing statement, “None of the above is meant as an apology for Atlantic Yards….” I am just trying to make the issue of the bridge closure clearer.
You are right, closing the bridge and city streets would be a PR move if it is not followed by work. However, it seems from the meeting mentioned in the Sun that work will commence shortly. That is why I (a) didn’t understand what you were saying and (b) answered the way I did. To reiterate, I am expecting real work to begin before the end of the year and possibly as soon as a month from now.
It seems from your second post that my use of the phrase “relocation of the rail yard” was probably too general. Many of your comments about what is located where are accurate. However, the reconstruction of the Carlton and Sixth Avenue bridges is related to the relocation of the rail yard and associated re-alignment of the tracks from the yard into Atlantic Terminal. This is explained in the environmental impact statement.
No offense, but you are upset by the real negative impacts cause by closing these two north-south streets and suggest closing Atlantic Avenue as an alternative? Please get some perspective, starting with relative traffic volumes. That said, there probably will be some disruptions on Atlantic at some point as well.
You ask, “why would FCR be doing all this infrastructure work?” I do not know, but guess that the work on the rail yard is part of the back-room dealing, a quid pro quo that doesn’t appear on the balance sheet like the sales price. I suspect that the LIRR said, if you want to do what you’re proposing, FCRC, we want you to do the following at your own expense to further goals of ours. My theory is at least consistent with how this project was birthed.
G-man, luckily few people if anyone checks this thread so it’s like our own little conversation.
I don’t know if you use this bridge regularly but it does not span rails…it doesn’t even span what should be called railyards. It spans what used to be a parking lot for buses (and supposedly will be repaved for construction worker parking for years to come). The rails dip in under Atlantic Avenue pretty much right at the juncture of the bridge and Atlantic Avenue. There is no “relocation of the rail yard” per se that should impact the bridge. If moving the rail lines (the couple that the LIRR still uses) is the issue, I’m wondering why Atlantic Avenue is not closed and dug up instead. The Carlton Avenue bridge is very far from railyard work that might need to be done to make way for the construction of the proposed arena. Carlton Avenue is well east, basically separating the western 2/3s of the site from the remaining eastern 1/3 of the site. This area is basically proposed to be parking lots for years.
That said, sorry, but I cannot find the 9-week reference I spotted regarding the bridge closure (I saw it in some fleeting reference in the paper I believe…never believed it would be 9 weeks anyway)… and yes, you’re right…it will probably take years before it opens again (unless the powers-that-be want it open).
Now…why would FCR be doing all this infrastructure work? WHY? They’ve been pussy-footin’ around not really making any real commitment to anything waiting to see what happens. I feel the closing of the bridge and City streets is a PR move at this point, a PR move that “is” cheap’n’easy. I’m not sure I made myself quite understood above. You didn’t get what I wrote above. I wasn’t expressing an idea that some supposed work will be cheap’n’easy but I was referring to the “PR move”; basically, the con. Look it…we’ve all seen it before; or, at least, many of us have. What may very well happen is that the bridge and street(s) get closed by the City licking FCR’s boot, the community is forced to get used to it and living this way, real visual blight sets in much like the illusion blight created by the blatant disregard the area has suffered recently by the City and the MTA…and it could sit and sit and sit for years, especially considering the ongoing legal battles and changing economy (both real estate markets and construction material costs).
You never addressed my main concerns: social fabric, Prospect Heights disruption, added congestion on Flatbush, pedestrian infeasibility to get across this part of Brooklyn.
Addressed to 3:50:
What/Who is Do Ned Al?
D-O-N-E-D-E-A-L!!!
1:58, you close with, “We need to know why the bridge is really being closed, when any proposed work on it REALLY will happen, and how long the closing will last.” In order:
The closure and reconstruction of the Carlton Avenue bridge is not directly related to the planned eventual decking over of the area. The reconstruction of the bridge is related to the relocation of the rail yard, a preliminary step to construction of the “arena block.” And if you think that rebuilding the bridge and the rail yard is “a cheap’n’easy way” to make it look like the project is moving forward, I’d hate to see what you think is expensive. If the lawsuits are successful, FCRC will have spend millions on infrastructure that generates no income to the company.
The NY Sun stated that the work will begin “soon” and that is accurate. Before Thanksgiving is a possibility.
The anticipated duration of the reconstruction is two years, although most construction (including a bathroom renovation) tends to run over. I don’t know where you got the nine week figure. No way you can replace an entire bridge in that much time.
None of the above is meant as an apology for Atlantic Yards, but you seem to be operating under several misconceptions. Maybe I should apply to become the omsbuddy….
Re: Ratner Closing AY-Area Streets Soon [NY Sun]
They’re going to close the Carlton Bridge needlessly to make it look like it’s all some big done-deal when nothing is certain as yet and they don’t even own or control all the property in the proposed footprint or have permits needed. In fact, there have been multiple SWOs on whatever they have legally started showing how sloppy and ill-managed it all is so far on the tiny amount of work they’ve done. Anyone remember Ward’s Bakery’s parapet collapsing? Hello! AND there are several court case ongoing. Nothing can be known until decisions are handed down.
The area the bridge covers is is set for a much later phase of building, very far from the proposed arena and adjacent towers. But the City’s powers-that-be appear to want to help make it look like the proposed project is moving along. Hello! It’s not. So what if great and sometimes landmarkable buildings are regrettably being demolished? The project is not moving forward and closing Carlton’s bridge and other streets is a cheap’n’easy way to make it look like it is. And a horrible way it is to strong-arm the residents and community! And, truth be told, the bridge will probably be closed VERY prematurely to ANY work being done, and then be closed for years, not the 9 weeks originally proposed for its closure.
1) Carlton is the main pedestrian thoroughfare communicating Fort Greene with Prospect Heights, Flatbush Avenue and Park Slope. I use it all the time and see lots of people using the bridge. I’ve never seen any effort made to count the number of pedestrians who use the bridge. It seems like a spiteful and community-destroying effort on the part of the developers to cut off the main communication between neighborhoods.
2) Carlton was just inaugurated as an official bike route. The City painted the lane and it gets HEAVY bike traffic.
3) A lot of drivers use Carlton Avenue and the bridge both to get to Fort Greene and more importantly as a thoroughfare to get to the BQE. They cut out the need to congest Flatbush all the way to the Tillary Street onramp by taking Carlton all the way from Flatbush, straight through to the next onramp for the BQE “east†of Tillary. In fact, drivers cut through Brooklyn going local using Carlton as the last leg to the BQE. What is going to happen when the traffic that now turns off Flatbush onto Carlton can no longer pass through Prospect Heights? Will this create more traffic down Flatbush to Tillary? Has this been studied clearly? Will this cause more traffic in Prospect Heights while drivers end up doubling back to Vanderbilt?
We need to know why the bridge is really being closed, when any proposed work on it REALLY will happen, and how long the closing will last.
http://www.newsday.com/news/local/nassau/ny-nyhome165414426oct16,0,5877633.story
Yep, Take this and multiply by thousands. We have one big clusterfuck!
Don’t think the Citigroup Mortgage shit superfund will save housing, it’s toast!
The What
Someday this war gonna end……
Really do look like WW2 gun turrets up there